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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:14:24 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom <...@launchmodem.com
After takin' a swig o' grog, Don Zeigler belched out
this bit o' wisdom:
Not at all. In fact, its better (to me) than the behavior of Word, which
asks you "You have a lot of information in the clipboard... Do you want to
keep it?"
Fsck you, Word, if I'd a-wanted it, I'd have opened up a clipboard app to
save it /myself/. Get outa my face.
So, I /prefer/ X's behavior.
--
Q: How many IBM types does it take to change a light bulb?
A: Fifteen. One to do it, and fourteen to write document number
GC7500439-0001, Multitasking Incandescent Source System Facility,
of which 10% of the pages state only "This page intentionally
left blank", and 20% of the definitions are of the form "A:.....
consists of sequences of non-blank characters separated by blanks".
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:12:27 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
Chris Ahlstrom stated in post iDp1...@bignews5.bellsouth.net on
6/27/09 7:14 AM:
The problem I have is not that the clipboard is lost, it is that it is
*sometimes* lost and sometimes not. It is inconsistent, and other than
through trial and error on a program by program basis, it is unpredictable.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:13:23 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
Don Zeigler stated in post
2009...@this.domain.or.that on 6/27/09 6:09 AM:
It does seem absurd to me, but the real problem I have is that it is
inconsistent - in some programs it is lost and in others it is not. That I
just whacked.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 14:41:50 +0000 (UTC), Don Zeigler <...@this.computer
Don Zeigler took another hit and mumbled:
Didn't mean to tick anyone off... anyhow, I installed glipper and everything
is copacetic now. =)
--
Lottery: a tax on people who are bad at math.
Regards,
DZ (Owner/proprietor, Trollus Amongus, LLC)
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 11:25:17 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom <...@launchmodem.com
After takin' a swig o' grog, Don Zeigler belched out
this bit o' wisdom:
Nah, you never tick anyone off, Don. The trolls are self-ticking. Not to
mention they're the blood-sucking ticks of this newsgroup. A nuttier bunch
of trolls would be difficult to find.
Good job, Skipper! :-D
--
You love your home and want it to be beautiful.
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:14:16 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
Don Zeigler stated in post 2009...@this.domain.or.that
on 6/27/09 7:41 AM:
Yes, there are several clip board managers that can be used to make things
more consistent... so the default weakness of Ubuntu can be altered and
fixed.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 13:02:47 -0500, RonB <...@gmail.com
I didn't even know about glipper (that how big of an issue Linux's
clipboard "problem" is for me). But I've got it now -- I guess I'll see
how it works.
--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 14:24:41 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom <...@launchmodem.com
After takin' a swig o' grog, RonB belched out
this bit o' wisdom:
I just use xclipboard (and have since the very beginning of my Linux
experience). Can't have gnome-settings-daemon or some other window manager
that takes over the clipboard running though.
xclipboard doesn't have saving and plugins, either, but I don't need 'em.
--
Q: Why did the lone ranger kill Tonto?
A: He found out what "kimosabe" really means.
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 09:01:36 -0600, High Plains Thumper <...@invalid.invalid
Apology accepted. :-)
I've never had any problems with the copy and paste capabilities
in Linux and the X Server. Have never had to install glipper,
and just like in any software environment, there will be
idiosyncrasies, Windows included that one learns to work with.
However, the trolls would like to make mountains from mole hills,
which personas such as Michael Glasser always does. Main reason
for these FUD's is to discredit Linux and FOSS.
The flatfish would have everyone believe that one needs $5K US in
software to operate a home recording studio doing Karaoke backing
tracks in Windows. This is absurd.
Since they have nothing better to say, they resort to ad hominem
attacks against Linux advocates, deflecting the issues to defend
their failed predatory monopoly maintainer.
--
HPT
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:16:40 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
High Plains Thumper stated in post 4a46...@read.cnntp.org
on 6/27/09 8:01 AM:
I have noted a problem with the Ubuntu clipboard. Where have I said this is
a big, little, or medium sized problem? I have noted people can install
other clipboard managers and get around the problem.
Then you have Rick who insists that Windows, although he cannot find how it
does not work consistently, has a "limitation" because it does not work as
he prefers without simple freeware. That is absurd and dishonest.
Please try to show where I do as you say.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 11:26:27 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom <...@launchmodem.com
After takin' a swig o' grog, High Plains Thumper belched out
this bit o' wisdom:
Another reasonable theory is that they're just mentally-ill assholes.
--
You mentioned your name as if I should recognize it, but beyond the
obvious facts that you are a bachelor, a solicitor, a freemason, and
an asthmatic, I know nothing whatever about you.
-- Sherlock Holmes, "The Norwood Builder"
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 12:59:56 -0500, RonB <...@gmail.com
Or cranks with the Mac drone mentality. "There should only be one way to
do everything -- and everyone must do it that way."
I always kind of liked Macs -- just too expensive to seriously consider
purchasing -- but the more I see of *some* of those who use Macs, the
less I like them. I was reading a commentary yesterday about how Oracle
should build a partnership with Ubuntu, since their "own" (Red Hat)
Linux has failed to impress and Oracle customers are sticking with Red
Hat. I personally thought it was kind of a dumb idea, but some Mac
nimrod had to write that "CNET always ignores Macs" in the commentary
section. Reality check here, dude. We're talking about a platform for
Oracle's databases -- how many Mac servers are there in the world?
Twenty? Good grief.
--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 11:07:32 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
RonB stated in post h25m...@news.eternal-september.org on 6/27/09 10:59
AM:
Who does that?
I know Rick recently said Windows was limited because it does not have the
middle click feature - by default - that he prefers. So Rick did what you
accused people, but in terms of Linux and not the Mac.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 11:14:24 -0400, Hans Lister <...@yahoo.com
We don't have to discredit Linux.
You Linux "advocates" in COLA are doing a fine job all by your
self.
Not true.
You could use Linux, Ardour and Audacity and do a decent job.
Streaming audio to disk is trivial.
It's the plugins that count and unless you have an acoustically
perfect studio, with top tier microphones, a tuned and record
able piano and musicians who know how to play......
.....you will be using plugins like softsynths etc.
That's where Linux dies.
If you want a sax that sounds like a sax instead of a kazoo you
need quality plugins.
If you want realistic sounding drums, you need a quality plugin.
And then when it comes time to mix and master your work of art,
you need effects plugins.
Windows/Mac have all the good ones.
Linux does not.
Get it.....??
You still don't know the definition of "ad hominem" do you?
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On 27 Jun 2009 15:57:35 GMT, TomB <...@gmail.com
On 2009-06-27, the following emerged from the brain of Hans Lister:
O_o
No, it isn't. And that's not all a daw does, you know.
Fluidsynth with a quality soundfont does the trick over here. As does
zynaddsubfx, which can produce amazing sounds.
Hydrogen can do that just fine.
Quality of ladspa plugins range from 'decent' to 'fscking awesome'.
They have the known ones...
--
Beam me up, Scotty! It ate my phaser!
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 12:03:42 -0400, Hans Lister <...@yahoo.com
Compared to processing the audio, it's trivial.
Even the free programs included with sound cards can do it.
Nothing like the stuff avaiable for Windows/Mac.
DFH
Ivory
Garritan
Mirasolv
etc..
Maybe if you're into electronic music Linux alternatives might
be fine but if you need real instruments Linux is dead in the
water.
For electronic sounds it's fine.
Drums From Hell
Addictive Drums
EzDrummer
and so forth blow it's doors off.
Many people use Drumagog to replace poorly recorded real
acoustic drums with samples from Drums From Hell because the
quality is that good.
I must be using the wrong ones then because they sound very
amateurish to me.
Sonnox, Waves and UAD blow them away.
You mean the ones that are used to make the vast majority of
music you listen to each day.
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On 27 Jun 2009 23:11:47 GMT, TomB <...@gmail.com
On 2009-06-27, the following emerged from the brain of Hans Lister:
Getting it to disc *is* processing. As is playing it back.
Sure. Even that little recorder thingy in Windows can do it. But not
as good as Ardour. Or ProTools. Or Reaper.
Any piece of soft/hardware that tries to mimic real instruments is
dead in the water. If you want real, you'll have to use real.
Drums can sound pretty realistic though. As can piano, and some other
instruments. Most other instruments sound hopelessly fake though. On
Mac, Windows and Linux.
For acoustic stuff too. It all depends on the samples you use.
Yes, the Drums From Hell samples are *very* good. The best thing is
that I can use them in Hydrogen as well.
I must admit that Drums From Hell has the better feature set though.
Some are not that good, that's true, but most are very good.
I wouldn't know. I can't spend € 500,00 + on a software
reverberator... I guess they do sound better, but then the entire
chain of equipment has to be top notch. For amateur to semi-pro usage
the marginal increase in quality just isn't worth it. Why use a €
500,00 software effect on sound recorded through a € 250,00 AD box,
using € 100,00 mics?
Yes, those I mean.
--
Iedereen wil erop, maar ze is te stijl.
~ Walter Grootaers
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 19:56:53 -0400, Hans Lister <...@yahoo.com
Processing, as in reverb,delay,noise printing and removal etc.
Depends upon what you are doing.
Not true anymore which is why a great majority of what you hear
recorded today are not real instruments and in many cases it's
almost impossible to tell.
You'd be very hard pressed to tell the difference between my
Steinway B and Ivory when recorded and I use AGK C414 mics on my
Steinway.
Listen to the Miraslov orchestral samples.
Garritan big band is another quite realistic one.
If you're looking for a realistic Fender stratocaster sound
though, you're out of luck.
I thought it sucked.
The samples yes.
They just improved the player a lot.
The original interface was way too complex which led people to
EzDrummer which sounds about 90 percent of DFH but has a much,
much better interface.
DFH now has the same interface, improved a lot.
It all depends upon what you are doing.
If you want a silky vocal you are going to need a high quality
mic and a high quality reverb.
If you're doing hip hop and want a grungy in your face sound the
last thing you need is a smooth reverb and mic.
Compression is another area as is processing like widening,
exciting etc.
Ozone 4 is amazing for doing that kind of stuff as is Tracks3.
There is nothing in the Linux world like that.
Restoration is another area where the Windows/Mac software
leads.
You can take noise prints and use them within the various tools
to clean up bad recordings etc.
Look, ardour and audacity are good programs and the plugins are
decent if you want free.
If you want professional level stuff, you need Windows/Mac and
it's going to cost you.
For me that's not a problem.
For others it may be.
One last thing, a professional level program in the hands of an
amateur can be a very bad thing yet at the same time a
professional can get the most out of an inexpensive plugin.
It all depends.
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On 28 Jun 2009 01:18:41 GMT, TomB <...@gmail.com
On 2009-06-27, the following emerged from the brain of Hans Lister:
This sums it up nicely. The art is in the man, not the machine.
--
Why is it called a funny bone when it hurts so much?
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 21:19:39 -0400, Hans Lister <...@yahoo.com
Amen brother!
BTW Marti did some nice work using Linux.
Not my taste in music, but interesting.
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On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 14:58:19 -0600, High Plains Thumper <...@invalid.invalid
Oh yeah, here's Flatfish as Moshe Goldfarb:
http://tinyurl.com/6m6a8c
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy, alt.os.linux.ubuntu
Subject: Re: [News] Red Hat Developer's Update on PulseAudio,
Fedora Live CDs Interview
Message-ID: Xns9...@66.250.146.128
Date: 11 Apr 2008 18:53:55 GMT
[Quote]
Well sorry to disappoint you, but I'm not in COLA. I'm reading
these posts in the Ubuntu group. The only reason they are going
to COLA is because whomever started the thread had it crossposted
there...and to Vista groups, which I removed because this has
nothing to do with Vista.
I'm NOT a Linux pusher, I still use Windows most of the time
since I'd just installed Linux a few weeks ago, maybe a month+
ago, and still checking out apps and learning Linux. There are
things I like and things I don't like.
Believe what you want to believe. It's painfully obvious that you
are completely anti-Linux, just like some are completely anti-MS,
and have such strong preconceived beliefs that it doesn't really
matter what anyone says about any particular Linux item,
everyone's a liar, and nothing works out-of-the-box.
[/Quote]
That is not what Flatfish said as nymshift Singer in this thread:
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/msg/f8ff83eaf9d28393
My Roland GW-7 and GeneralMusic WK2HD Midi Arranger work just
fine. If one is a musician they will most likely be using a
decent keyboard instrument and hard wired midi, not soft synthesis.
Nonsense, such big fuss about plugins. If one wants professional
sounds, go to a professional sound card or midi instrument.
Again, nonsense.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ardour_(audio_processor)
[quote]
Plugins
Ardour relies on plugins to enable many features from audio
effects processing to dynamic control. Ardour supports the LADSPA
and LV2 plugin architectures on Linux and additionally Audio
Units on OS X. Using Steinberg's VST plugins with Ardour on Linux
is possible if Ardour is compiled by the user or
packager/distributor to include VST support. As of version 2.8,
VST support no longer requires use of the VST SDK from Steinberg.[7]
7.^ "Ardour 2.8 Released". http://ardour.org/node/2555. Retrieved
on 2009-03-28.
[/quote]
Same party line parroted by DFS, Snit, Hadron, Tim Smith, and ad
nauseum. One can present the pure definition from a dictionary,
sound commentary from several reasonable blogs, expanded
definition from an Ask-It site, and they will continue in denial
but denigrate advocates using it. This only indicates their
intention to troll this Usenet.
--
HPT
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On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:02:57 -0400, COLA Sucubus Hunter <...@Hunter15.com
<snipped
LOL, I see why they call it 'High Plains Hypocrite'. :)
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:44:06 -0600, High Plains Thumper <...@invalid.invalid
Rather sad that this troll takes a statement I quoted from
someone else, attributes it to me then ad hominem's my nym in
support of the flatfish troll.
Here it is again:
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy, alt.os.linux.ubuntu
From: DanS <...@a.d.e.l.p.h.i.a.n.e.tDate: 11 Apr 2008 18:53:55 GMT
Subject: Re: [News] Red Hat Developer's Update on PulseAudio,
Fedora Live CDs Interview
DanS: "I could do all of this with you physically in the room and
watching everything happen and you _still_ wouldn't believe it.
I'm doing nothing but wasting my time, so, I'm done with you."
Moshe Goldfarb (flatfish): "I doubt you even got it to start....
See my other post. Dan, you're probably a nice guy, but we get a
ton of 'works for me' crap in COLA and most times it's just
people telling lies."
DanS: "Well sorry to dissapoint you, but I'm not in COLA. I'm
reading these posts in the Ubuntu group. The only reason they are
going to COLA is because whomever started the thread had it
crossposted there...and to Vista groups, which I removed because
this has nothing to do with Vista."
"I'm NOT a Linux pusher, I still use Windows most of the time
since I'd just installed Linux a few weeks ago, maybe a month+
ago, and still checking out apps and learning Linux. There are
things I like and things I don't like."
"Believe what you want to believe. It's painfully obvious that
you are completely anti-Linux, just like some are completely
anti-MS, and have such strong preconceived beliefs that it
doesn't really matter what anyone says about any particular Linux
item, everyone's a liar, and nothing works out-of-the-box."
"What do you need.....unedited 8mm analog film proof ?! Analog so
you won't claim it was edited. (Rhetorical, since I won't be
replying to you anymore.)"
--
HPT
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 07:08:57 -0400, COLA Sucubus Hunter <...@Hunter17.com
No one gives a shit about it. And no gives a shit about your jack-off
usual response.
I shot an arrow into the sky and your dumbass fell out of it as usual. <VBG>
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On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 15:46:05 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
High Plains Thumper stated in post 4a47...@read.cnntp.org
on 6/28/09 1:58 PM:
Why don't you just learn the meaning of the term and use it correctly?
Seriously, isn¹t that easier than such lashing out?
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 09:06:52 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
High Plains Thumper stated in post h2a5...@news.albasani.net on 6/29/09
3:32 AM:
Seriously, HPT, why no just learn what it means instead of just lashing out?
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:38:57 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom <...@launchmodem.com
After takin' a swig o' grog, High Plains Thumper belched out
this bit o' wisdom:
Interesting!
--
You will not be elected to public office this year.
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:52:59 -0600, High Plains Thumper <...@invalid.invalid
Flatfish and the other trolls would like one to believe that FOSS
is a total failure and one must resort to expensive proprietary
applications as solutions for the home user.
Windows used to have a lot of writers providing freeware,
shareware and some low-costware. Nowadays, there are in
comparison very few writers, one wonders why.
Ardour is professionally written:
[quote]
Supporting companies
SAE Institute provided corporate support for Ardour up until
February of 2009. The aim of the initiative was to provide a more
integrated experience on Mac OS X and the development of a
version tailored towards beginner students.[8]
Solid State Logic employed Paul Davis to work full time on Ardour
during the development of the version 2. This support lasted
through to the end of 2006.[9]
Harrison Audio Consoles has been a supporter of the Ardour
project since early 2005. Harrison's destructive film dubber, the
Xdubber, is based on Ardour. The Xdubber also serves as a
customizable platform for enterprise-class DAW users.[10]
References
8. ^ SAE Institute Sponsors Ardour Open Source DAW Project
http://ardour.org/node/976
9. ^ Ardour Seeks New Sponsorship http://ardour.org/sponsorship
10. ^ "Harrison Debuts Xrouter, Xdubber".
http://livefromaes.com/articles/publish/article_248.shtml.
[/quote]
--
HPT
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:04:08 -0400, Hans Lister <...@yahoo.com
Wrong again HPT.
Because times have changed and they realize they can make money.
The same exact thing will happen to Linux developers should
Linux become popular enough.
Of course it is.
Who said it wasn't?
What happened after February 2009?
That's a good use for Linux and Ardour, but how well is the
console selling?
Harrison makes excellent equipment FWIW.
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 17:05:50 -0700 (PDT), dawhead <...@equalarea.com
On Jun 29, 12:04 pm, Hans Lister <...@yahoo.com
SAE decided that the project had met it goals and therefore ceased
funding further development at that time.
its not a console, its a destructive recorder mostly targetting the
post-production marketplace that has relied on tascam mmr-8's.
all of which runs linux on off-the-shelf components.
Paul Davis
Ardour/JACK.
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 15:35:02 +0200, Peter Köhlmann <...@t-online.de
It would be plain stupid to do it otherwise by default.
The X clipboard is *networkable* and so the selected content is not
necessarily residing on the local machine.
How do you propose the memory being used to retain the content is managed?
By what instance or program? For how long?
You open up shed loads of cans of worms if you apply a local machine only
clipboard behaviour like the ones of windows or OSX to the much more
flexible one of X.
*If* you want to have that type of behaviour, use programs like Klipper or
Glipper. In that case *they* are responsible for the memory management,
and the problems vanish. You also get *more* functionality than standard
windows/OSX clipboard will provide
But by all means, do *not* apply the limited, restricted windows/OSX
clipboard to X just because you are accustomed to their type of working.
You end up with less functionality, not more. And all that just because
intellectual dwarves like Snot Michael Glasser or Hadron Snot Quark are
simply too damn stupid to successfully pour a bucket of water, and for
that reason simply can't grasp the background of the X clipboard
--
Real programmers don't comment their code. It was hard to write,
it should be hard to understand.
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On Sat, 27 Jun 2009 10:17:51 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
Peter Köhlmann stated in post h257...@news.t-online.com on 6/27/09
6:35 AM:
Again: the problem I have is the inconsistency... the lack of predictability
without prior trial and error. You have been told this repeatedly... and
show no capability to understand.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 19:36:07 -0600, GPS <...@xmission.com
The server could store the data, and in fact there has been some talk
amongst X developers about doing that. In the times when the ICCCM protocol
was defined my understanding was that memory usage was a concern. This is
probably partially why the INCR protocol exists for X selection transfers.
Essentially when a program's Copy occurs, that program then sets itself as
the selection owner. There is no actual copying occurring at that point of
the selection data. When another client does Paste the X server sends a
request (eventually) to the owner, and the owner then responds with the data
(if it can). The first part of the protocol involves sending a list of
TARGETS, and then the pasting client can request one of the TARGETS from the
list, and finally it requests the data and reads it in 1 or more events
(depending on INCR).
A clipboard manager works by greedily pulling the data from a client that
takes ownership of CLIPBOARD (usually).
Peter, the X selection management is a problem. There are many types for
graphics, many types for rich text, and many encoding types for text.
Considering that every X toolkit, or X application must work with the
protocol, and the many different formats/types in the TARGETS list, I think
it would help to replace the X selection mechanism with something simpler
that uses the knowledge gained from years of working on such things.
Some X developers have plans for ideas similar to this for X12:
http://www.x.org/wiki/Development/X12
-George
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On Tue, 30 Jun 2009 06:54:15 +0200, Peter Köhlmann <...@t-online.de
< snip
Nope, not for me. Never has been any
That has absolutely *nothing* to do with the alleged "problem" which is
being discussed here: That selected clipboard items vanish the moment the
owner app disappears. Which is standard X behaviour since a *long* time,
although mental midgets here try to imply that as a "failure"
As long as they retain the network part of the X clipboard, fine.
I simply don't want a clipboard as limited as the windows/OSX one.
--
Warning: You have moved the mouse.
Windows will reboot now to make the change permanent
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On Mon, 29 Jun 2009 22:18:20 -0700, Snit <...@gallopinginsanity.com
Peter Köhlmann stated in post h2c5...@news.t-online.com on 6/29/09
9:54 PM:
My concern was not that the clipboard was lost but that it is not consistent
- sometimes it is lost and sometimes it is not.
Here you are calling others "mental midgets", but this very simple concept
has clearly gone over your head.
Can you describe an example of where the OS X's clipboard is limited in
comparison to the one on, say, Ubuntu?
I bet not. Heck, everyone in COLA knows you cannot. All wind... that is
what you are.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
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