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On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 10:56:45 -0700 (PDT), Greg Mossman <...@qnet.com
On Apr 27, 10:33 am, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
We're overpopulated. A small epidemic is good for society, just like
small forest fires are good for overall forest health. The difference
is that we Californians are healthy. Think of what a good flu will do
in diseased humid elderly Florida. Maybe you'll be able to get
another generator!
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On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 17:16:35 -0700, "Scott" <...@geemail.com
None, it's Bush's fault.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 10:31:19 +1000, "dechucka" <...@hotmail.com
"Scott" <...@supernews.com...
That is as logical as Lee's post
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 09:40:44 +1000, "dechucka" <...@hotmail.com
"Lee Bell" <...@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
Any thinking non racist person is not even making the connection. You are
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On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 19:05:50 -0500, Jer <...@airmail.ten
Agreed. The idea of illegal immigrants bringing this pig flu to the
U.S. is rather implausible, in that it's unlikely a stricken individual
would survive the trip across the border. This thing is killing a few
in Mexico because those people don't have ready access to health care
via a nice comfortable health insurance policy, and they wait until
they're damn near dead before seeing a doctor. I've heard no comment
about the pre-infection health condition of those that have died.
Chances are this infection is riding in a legal bus across the border.
--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 10:30:39 +1000, "dechucka" <...@hotmail.com
"Jer" <...@posted.internetamerica...
Same way it got to Europe and New Zealand
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Anonymous Wrote:
Yeah, bunch of bloody schoolkids sneezing their way home in the
cramped environment of a plane. At least they caught on about it
before they went to school and we had several hundred kids carrying it
around town.
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On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 22:31:47 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
I'm pretty sure it didn't get to Europe or New Zealand on a bus.
Where was the plane coming from?
Lee
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Anonymous Wrote:
On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 22:31:47 -0400, "Lee Bell"
<...@bellsouth.net
Mexico via LA the news said, the plane they're still trying to trace
18 tourists off that the kids were on was NZ1, thats the weekday
LA-Auckland direct flight. It was a spanish class from one of
Aucklands high decile schools off on an "immersive language event"
which translates as a holiday somewhere where the official language is
the one being studied, in this case, mexico.
there was a scare about another high school spanish class but that
turned up negitive results on the tests.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:11:57 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Hope you guys manage to control the disease without to much trouble. Any
time something like this moves from one area to a vastly remote other area,
the potential that the population will not have built defenses against it
increases. History is full of disasters from diseases unwittingly shared
from a place where it's been a minor bother to places where it decimates the
population.
Perhaps I'm being optimistic, but I'm not too worried about the US. We've
been exposed to everything and anything from all our bordering countries for
a long time. Our health systems may or may not be the best in the world,
but they're good. Various kinds of flu have been around before and we've
developed, if not an immunity, at least a resistance to them that has to at
least partially mitigate the impact of this one. So far, so good.
On the other hand, more than a week ago, I got a message indicating that the
federal government is making advanced flu treatments available to all its
employees, starting with those in Washington, DC and, once they're covered,
extending to the rest of the employees. That's usually a sign that those in
DC take things seriously and are protecting their own butts. I would not
bet much that the benefits ever will actually be available to the working
portion of the government.
Lee
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Anonymous Wrote:
On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:11:57 -0400, "Lee Bell"
<...@bellsouth.net
when bird flu and SARS were the pacnic drivers and the doom sayers
were proclaming the end of the world was nigh, the District Health
Boards and Civil Defence drew up pandemic emergency plans.
So this flap was pretty much just a case of pull those plans off the
shelf and susistute "Pig" for "Bird"
So far every thing seems under control :D
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On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 22:30:00 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Jer wrote
Funny that there's a concentration of cases in the border towns of
California and Texas.
Any thinking person who knew that the disease started in Mexico and, in the
US, was concentrated in areas where illegals most often cross the border
would find it hard not to make the connection.
In its initial stages, it's just like any other case of the flu. People
travel with the flu all the time.
On the other hand, I suppose it might be illegal immigrant pigs crossing the
border, but I think people are more likely.
I believe you are correct. I've not researched what's going on here very
thoroughly, but what I've seen on this so far suggests that all cases in the
US have recovered.
We can guess, but I haven't heard anything difinitive either.
You have a site for that or are you just guessing?
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 04:21:50 -0500, Jer <...@airmail.ten
On any given day of the week, 3-7 autobuses de lujo unload legal
travelers from Mexico at the local bus station.
The one I've used is Enlaces Terrestres Nacionale (ETN) offering twice
daily service for primera plus, diamante, and uno price ranges. There's
Omnibus de Mexico that also offers directo service thrice weekly. Both
companies offer multiple drop points on both sides of the border.
I don't recommend the segunda clase buses because I don't want a mule
for a seatmate, and if they lose a wheel enroute, the mule is gonna be
grumpy.
--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:26:34 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Good information, but inconclusive. How many people cross that way versus
the number crossing illegally? How many that cross legally, stay illegally.
You've provided input to the answer, but you're not there yet.
Lee
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 19:54:52 -0500, Jer <...@airmail.ten
It's my understanding that all the passengers have passports since
everyone has to show it at the border station. Numbers I have no clue
about, but the bus has 46 seats with a butt in every one. Today, I
noticed some were deboarding with masks on, same thing at the airport.
Oops, there goes the efficacy of the facial recognition system.
--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 23:53:42 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
People with masks are all over the local news, as are scanning systems being
used in some parts of the world to detect elevated temperatures, as in
fevers. This may not be the pandemic that everybody fears, but it's sure
being treated that way.
Lee
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On Mon, 27 Apr 2009 22:19:34 -0500, "Chris Guynn" <...@gmail.net
Funny, according to the CDC (http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/), the largest
concentration of cases is in New York. Do they share a border with Mexico?
For that matter, even Kansas has just as high a concentration as Texas.
I do find it amusing that something called the swine flu has hit the
democratic states harder than the republican ones though.
Sure, if that was true.
In its later stages, it's also not that different from any other case of the
flu. The problem isn't that this particular strain of the flu is any more
potent than other strains so much as it is that people aren't immunized
against this strain which allows it to spread more easily and, potentially,
to cause a higher number of deaths simply because more poeple are infected.
Or it could be people who are crossing the border completely legally.
That's the current condition.
Based on the fact that it says "chances", I'm going with the guessing
option.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 04:21:46 -0500, Jer <...@airmail.ten
I heard today that it's not necessarily the flu that kills the host -
it's the rapid onset of fluid buildup in the lungs that gets the job
done due to the lack of immunity.
--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:19:30 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Effectively the same thing.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:18:42 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Not all illegal immigrants stay in the states closest to the border and not
all immigrants from Mexico are illegal. The fact that there is a larger
concentration somewhere else, takes nothing away from the ones that are
along the border.
It's interesting, but it would only be amusing if Nancy, Joe and Barak were
diagnoses with the disease. Not to worry, however, the federal government
is already sharing, free of charge, advance treatment with its employees,
starting, of course, with those in DC. I got the message about a week ago.
If you didn't get one too, you might want to ask somebody why.
The scientists seem to think it is.
Or both. Actually, it can't be people crossing legally since it's illegal
to enter the US with certain communicable diseases, including this one. In
the context you intended, though, you're right. We are at risk from those
we allow to enter the country legally. That does not justify accepting the
risk from those that enter illegally.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 10:52:09 -0500, "Chris Guynn" <...@gmail.net
The fact of the matter is that the concentrations aren't along the border
towns.
Two cases in Texas, both of them in San Antonio, doesn't exactly qualify as
a concentration, and even if it did, San Antonio isn't a "border town".
There are seven cases in California, and I suppose they could be in border
towns, but I hardly think that supports your position of concentration of
cases in border towns in California and Texas. The largest concentration is
in New York and the most liely case is that the immigrants were most likely
otherwise legal (and may even have been citizens).
To each his own.
I don't work for the federal government.
Really? The scientists think that the disease is concentrated in areas
where illegals most often cross the border? Maybe someone should explain
what "concentrated" means to them then.
Even if you're a citizen?
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 12:07:37 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Chris Guynn wrote
Check your numbers again. I found more than that several days ago. I
didn't pay a lot of attention to where they were except that they were in
the southeastern portion of the state. The San Antonio cases were on the
map as well.
The concentration was in San Diego. A few more showed up around Sacremento.
I was being more than a little sarcastic. I find it absolutely shameful
that the DC politicians are taking care of themselves, at the taxpayer's
expense, before taking care of the rest of the government and without any
apparent plans to take care of anybody else at all.
Feel free. The instances were plotted on a map, making the concentrations a
bit hard to miss.
Yes, even if you're a citizen.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 13:57:13 -0500, "Chris Guynn" <...@gmail.net
Do you have a cite for that?
According to http://www.pigflumap.com, the vast majority of cases in Texas
are located in and around San Antonio (SA). A map on Google Maps seems to
show the same thing (http://preview.tinyurl.com/d4lknq), but it's possible
that both maps are using the same data. This site
(http://homepage.ntlworld.com/keir.clarke/flu.htm) is interesting, but not
especially useful since the timeline is not accurate.
Apparently, as of today, Texas is up to six confirmed cases. Of those,
three are in SA and the other three are in Dallas (or surrounding areas).
There are still five unconfirmed cases in SA. I haven't seen anything in my
research about any other possible cases.
New York City is still the leader in concentration with a newly updated
forty five confirmed cases.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 18:05:45 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
I'll see if I can find it again. I had to look for a while to find it the
first time. Since the map is updated as new cases turn up, it may not still
look like it did when I first found it, just before the post that started
this thread.
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 11:52:54 +1000, "dechucka" <...@hotmail.com
"Lee Bell" <...@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
for you information http://healthmap.org/swineflu
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 13:02:54 -0700 (PDT), Greg Mossman <...@qnet.com
On Apr 28, 11:57 am, "Chris Guynn" <...@gmail.net
And don't forget the new case in that hot border state of Indiana.
Population-wise, isn't the per-capita incidence of swine flu actually
higher in the hot border state of Kansas than in California?
Damn Kansans and their swine. We Jews were right about the pig.
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Anonymous Wrote:
On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 13:02:54 -0700 (PDT), Greg Mossman
<...@qnet.com
In what sense ? You can fuck it but you can't eat it ?
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 16:28:27 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
The first confirmed death from Swine Flu in the US has now been confirmed.
It was a baby in Houston.
Lee
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 14:53:46 -0700 (PDT), Greg Mossman <...@qnet.com
On Apr 29, 1:28 pm, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Obviously it's time to stop eating babies.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 08:32:51 +0000, "Grumman-581" <...@gmail.com
"Lee Bell" <...@bignews1.bellsouth.net:
We knew we had a wild boar problem here in Texas, we just didn't know that
they are from Mexico and bringing swine flu with them... Sounds like you
need to get your prairie dog hunting gear and come down here for a little
fun along the border...
Nawh... Need something probably a bit bigger... Got a 45-70?
--
See NNTP header field "X-Real-Email-Address" to reply by email.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:24:23 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
I guarantee that a well placed 60 grain bullet, traveling at something in
excess of 4,000 feet per second, will do that job. I'd be happy to help, if
it were not for trouble getting critical components to replace those used
reducing your risk. I have plenty of cases, but bullets, primers and
powder are getting hard to find. Weapons are not the only things that Barak
has managed to increase sales of. Ammunition and ammunition component
manufacturers are running extended shifts just trying to keep up with
demand, and failing.
I have a 30-06 that can reach out and touch something, but I have less than
20 rounds for it, all of which are at least 25 years old. I haven't fired
it in a long time.
Lee
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 18:09:48 -0400, "Curtis" <...@yahoo.com
"Lee Bell" wrote
Oldest rounds I ever fired were senior citizens, over 65 years old, pre
WW2 surplus of a semi-obsolete caliber. A little "warm", but within the
pressure capabilities of the bolt & chamber. Only hitch was the Berdan?
primers. Can you say make sure the bore is scrubbed?
Curtis
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 19:34:07 +0000, "Grumman-581" <...@gmail.com
"Lee Bell" <...@bignews8.bellsouth.net:
Yeah, but probably not as well as a 500 grain bullet traveling at 1800
fps...
I can find powder as long as I'm not all that picky about which type of
powder... Primers on the other hand are next to impossible to find... I
have around 6000 on order right now from PowderValley, but they have no
idea when they will be in... About the only primers I've seen in stock
lately are .50BMG and shotgun...
--
See NNTP header field "X-Real-Email-Address" to reply by email.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 18:07:50 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Dead is dead.
I still have more in stock than you have on order, but I shoot a lot more
than you do too. I need to do an inventory of everything and get my orders,
make that back orders, into the que.
Lee
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 02:42:08 +0000, "Grumman-581" <...@gmail.com
"Lee Bell" <...@bignews4.bellsouth.net:
Too late for the back order... Order now and it'll be the "back back back
back orders"...
--
See NNTP header field "X-Real-Email-Address" to reply by email.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 23:45:21 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Not really. Predictions are that production will catch up with demand in
only a few more months. I don't know exactly how many primers I have, but I
suspect that, even at two or three hundred rounds a week, I have enough to
way beyond that.
Lee
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 12:51:20 -0700, "Scott" <...@geemail.com
My .270 with 130 grain Nosler partitions at 3100 fps hollowed 'em right out.
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 08:17:22 +1000, "Brad" <...@spammail.com
"Scott" <...@supernews.com...
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| My .270 with 130 grain Nosler partitions at 3100 fps hollowed 'em right
out.
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What you need is roo shooters, experienced at spotlighting, gives you 24
hour coverage, usually head shots on game the same size but smaller heads.
They don't waste ammo as that reduces profit, head shots because you are
selling the skin and it's humane. All you need to do is set up a system for
the tags. Wonder if tattooed hides would fetch a better price.
For a better coverage you need the buff and camel shooters from the NT. They
operate by hanging out the door of helicopters with a lever action 30-30 or
similar and by law must do headshots even on galloping 500kg beasts.
Even my old 243 was good for 1000m in daylight, usually only a chest shat at
that range.
Not that I would approve of such tactics being used on Latinos, Western
highlanders here on the other hand.
--
Brad Leyden
6 43.5816' S 146 59.3097' E WGS84
To mail spam is really hot but please reply to thread so all may benefit (or
laugh at my mistakes)
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 23:48:31 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
Let's don't point this too far in the wrong direction. I was speaking of
shooting pigs, the kind with four legs, not people. Illegal immigration is
a crime, but it's not one that, in my opinion, warrants deadly force except,
of course, when those smuggling them and drugs into the US escalate things.
Lee
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Anonymous Wrote:
On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 19:34:07 +0000, "Grumman-581"
<...@gmail.com
maybe you need to import, last time I was at the store, they had a
carton box of primers newly opened. from the size, there must have
been a good 100 or more 100 primer packets in the carton, and 5
cartons on the shelf. That was just in the stack out in the store, I'm
sure they had more cartons out the back.
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On Tue, 28 Apr 2009 23:51:53 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
I have several cartons of the four sizes I use, small and large pistol and
small and large rifle. Short term, I'm in good shape. I've always
purchased in multi thousand quantities, whether it's bullets or primers.
Unfortunately, many of those I enjoy competing with didn't. We're actually
creating a rimfire match within our regular matches to accommodate those
that can't, or won't afford today's higher ammo costs.
Lee
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 02:44:56 +0000, "Grumman-581" <...@gmail.com
rhys...@N.O.S.P.A.M.yahoo.co.nz wrote in
news...@4ax.com:
How much are they going for? Hell, some of the ones we buy over here are
imported anyway... The Wolf primers are from Russia, I believe...
--
See NNTP header field "X-Real-Email-Address" to reply by email.
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Anonymous Wrote:
On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 02:44:56 +0000, "Grumman-581"
<...@gmail.com
The ones I have from the local sports shop I bought last year and the
sticker on the tray of 100 says $9.99, back of the pack says made in
the USA.
checking the online store I tend to buy from other times has
winchester for $9 per pack of 100 and Federal Premiums for $9/100 and
Federal Match for $11/100
the exchange rate is somewhere around 50c USD for $1 NZD, so thats
about $4.50 - $5 per 100. Which includes a GST (goods and sales tax)
amount of 12.5% in the price overseas orders wouldn't have to pay.
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 06:51:11 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
I don't know anybody that buys less than 1,000 at a time. Most of us that
reload frequently, buy 10,000 or more at a time. Here, we have a hazmat fee
of $20 per shipment on top of the cost and buying more not only gets a
volume discount, it spreads that hazmat fee over a larger volume. Until the
current craziness hit, primers were going for about $20 US per thousand in
orders or 5,000 or more. Currently, the price is somewhere between $25 and
$30 per thousand from sites that are not gouging their customers. I've seen
primers purchased for as much as $125 per thousand in recent small 1 or 2
thousand primer quantities. Supply and demand are definitely at work here.
Be sure that those of us that reload enough to qualify as good customers
will not forget who kept their prices reasonable and who took advantage of
the opportunity to gouge those that used to trust them.
Your price comes out to somewhere around $50 per thousand. That's not a
good price, but it's not the worst either. The question here would be, are
the primers actually available for that price. I find it interesting that
everything you quoted comes from an American factory. It begs the question
of whether anybody but Wolf manufactures primers anyplace but here.
Lee
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 13:43:31 +0000, "Grumman-581" <...@gmail.com
rhys...@N.O.S.P.A.M.yahoo.co.nz wrote in
news...@4ax.com:
Around here, they are going for around $22-30 or so per 1000... Well, to be
precice, you can BACKORDER them for that price... Plus around a $20 HAZMAT
fee per order, so you tend to buy a lot of powder and primer per order to
minimize the HAZMAT charges on a per item basis...
--
See NNTP header field "X-Real-Email-Address" to reply by email.
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 16:32:12 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
I'll do my inventory before the end of next week. I may be back ordering as
many as 50,000 small pistol primers. If I need small rifle primers, I may
split my order between the two. I think I'm OK with large pistol primers
and I'm sure I have all the large rifle primers I'll need for a long time to
come.
Lee
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Anonymous Wrote:
On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 16:32:12 -0400, "Lee Bell"
<...@bellsouth.net
certainly comes down to supply and demand. Very few here in NZ
actually reload, I'd load probably 300 rounds of .303 a year, and buy
my .308, of which I shoot maybe 60 rounds a year, ready made. Compared
to most NZ recreational shooter/hunter, that makes me a heavy user for
around here, but thats probably only a weekend at the range for you
guys :P
It also comes down to population base, NZ is only 4 million, and our
shooting base is far more skewed towards hunters than range shooters,
5 rounds at deer over a hunt is a lot less ammo than a couple of
hundred at a range session.
So less demand equals less supply and higher prices. At least no
Hazmat charges on primers and live ammo, they just have to go courier
instead of standard post.
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 19:54:13 -0500, "Chris Guynn" <...@gmail.net
That wouldn't even make a good warm up round.
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On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 21:23:33 -0400, "Lee Bell" <...@bellsouth.net
In a month, I shoot just over 100 pistol rounds every Thursday night,
another 100 on the first and second Sundays of each month and about 60
rounds of rifle ammunition and 25 rounds of shotgun ammunition on the third
Tuesday night of each month. We have a practice night on the second Tuesday
of every month where, if I shoot at all, I shoot somewhere between 200 and
400 rounds. That comes out somewhere in the range of 1,000 rounds a month.
Even if you include sighting in.
Interestingly, both primers and powder are subject to a hazmat fee here, but
put them together and they're suddenly not hazardous any more. In fact, I
can carry up to 5 kilos of ammo in my checked baggage when traveling by air.
Lee
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