Welcome to Omgili,
Omgili ( Oh My God I Love It ;) is a search engine for discussions. With Omgili you can find answers and solutions, debates, discussions, personal experiences, opinions and more... To learn more about Omgili click here.
This is a complete preview of the discussion as it was indexed by Omgili crawlers. Use this preview if the original discussion is unavailable.
Click here to view the original discussion.
 |
|
 |
|
Modern slimming diets - Japan Forums
High-carbohydrate, low-fat diets have been recommended since 1,500 BC.
Banting's diet ・a high-fat, low-carbohydrate diet which had no calorie restriction ・had always been out of step with all other diets.
It worked, and this meant that people using it did not become fat and did not need to spend money continually struggling to stay slim.
But when it was hypothesised that a fatty diet could cause heart disease all that changed.
People could be exploited again.
Thus, all modern diets have reverted to the discredited early-19th-century theory, relying on one overriding philosophy: if you are overweight, you must cut down the calories, starting with the most calorie-dense fat.
All modern diets, therefore, work on only one principle: cut down.
In effect, you starve.
It is a dangerous course of action unless great care is taken.
The first thing any eating pattern must do is provide a 'balanced' diet.
That simply means a diet that provides all the nutrients your body needs in sufficient quantity to prevent deficiencies from occurring.
Nutrients such as vitamins and minerals, which are required in small quantities, can all be met on a restricted-calorie diet because supplementary pills can be taken.
However, where your body needs large amounts of a particular nutrient, it is not so easy.
Your body needs water, for example, every day.
Fortunately, perhaps, water contains no calories so there is no restriction on the amount you can drink.
But your body also needs complete proteins every day, and with proteins come calories.
Mesothelioma Cancer Dieting Tips slimming diet Cosmetic surgeries Facial surgery
|
|
 |
|
 |
|
|
|
|
Around this neck of the woods, people seem to prefer post-modern diets.
You are simply too late.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Weight gained or lost is determined by the amount of calories you eat.
WHAT is gained and WHAT is lost is determined by the type of food you eat.
It's really that simple.
Eat high protien and fat (Healthy fat) and restrict your carbs to healthy carbs (Sweet potatoes, oats, whole grains) and count your calories and you will slowly learn what your body needs and doesn't need.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Weight gained or lost is determined by the amount of calories you eat.
WHAT is gained and WHAT is lost is determined by the type of food you eat.
It's really that simple.
Eat high protien and fat (Healthy fat) and restrict your carbs to healthy carbs (Sweet potatoes, oats, whole grains) and count your calories and you will slowly learn what your body needs and doesn't need.
What is lost and gained is based on the often overlooked second factor - how many calories you USE.
Sitting on your arse you are using very little calories, simply get out and go walking for 40mins every day and you will see a difference even on a "crappy" diet.
Carbs are not the evil that they have been made out to been.
Yes, protein is great, even more if you are a body builder, but for the average person carbs are a good source of energy and as long as you are burning them off theres no problems.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Another thing that is needed is regularl exercise.
You can diet all you want but like ewok said you need to at least walk, other wise what you lose comes back.
With that I'm off to the gym!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : What is lost and gained is based on the often overlooked second factor - how many calories you USE.
Sitting on your arse you are using very little calories, simply get out and go walking for 40mins every day and you will see a difference even on a "crappy" diet.
Carbs are not the evil that they have been made out to been.
Yes, protein is great, even more if you are a body builder, but for the average person carbs are a good source of energy and as long as you are burning them off theres no problems.
I don't think you would see a healthy difference just going out and walking on a 'crappy diet'.
You may lose some weight, but you would probably lose muscle and not fat on a 'crappy diet'.
Carbs are certainly not evil, they have their place.
It's all about what carbs you eat and how much you eat.
Protein converts to carbs when needed.
You don't actually NEED carbs (They are a non-essential macronutrient).
Keeping your protein high ensures you hold onto what muscle you have which is what you want.
In the end, a crappy diet is a crappy diet.
You get nowhere with a crappy diet.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I say bring back the vomitoriums.
That'll fix everything.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Check this http://areyouhealthy.blogspot.com/
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : I don't think you would see a healthy difference just going out and walking on a 'crappy diet'.
You may lose some weight, but you would probably lose muscle and not fat on a 'crappy diet'.
Its been found that what you eat isn't as important as how much exercise you get.
For someone who does no exercise, go outside and raising your heartbeat for 40minutes does a world of difference.
Trust me when I say simply 40minutes a day does make a difference.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Its been found that what you eat isn't as important as how much exercise you get.
For someone who does no exercise, go outside and raising your heartbeat for 40minutes does a world of difference.
Trust me when I say simply 40minutes a day does make a difference.
I'd love to see where you've read this.
Both play an important role in your health, but I would say that if you ate junk food all day and sat in front of the computer and walked 40 minutes and compared that to someone who ate healthy food all day, sat in front of the computer and didn't walk for 40 minutes, I would put my money on the person eating the healthier food.
When people go to the gym and expect to get really big, or to drop a ton of fat and they DON'T they think they aren't working at the gym hard enough.
They try harder and harder but end up over-training in most cases.
It all comes down to diet.
Eating more fish (Or taking in fish oil supplements) can help combat mild-depression.
Comsume more protein and fewer carbs can prevent you from becoming tired after eating a nice meal (I know I feel like sleeping after a few slices of pizza)
Would you agree or disagree?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Would you agree or disagree?
Are you talking about your average person, or someone who is trying to bulk?
An average person works a majority of their day, eats at odd hours and gets minimal exercise.
As long as they are their nutrients it doesn't matter so much what they are eating as long as they are getting sufficent exercise .
I'll say it again, what you eat is not as important as the amount of exercise you get, which determines the amount used.
Calories In < Calories Used then (theoretically) you get weight loss.
I know at least one famous case of someone going on a fast food diet and by exercising appropriatly has had no ill effects what so ever.
Www.mcles.com
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
What you eat and how you eat it needs to be given more attention than the exercise.
Both are necessary if you want to do some body sculpting, but you need to fit your diet to whatever you're trying to accomplish.
Exercise is the easy part.
Eating is the hard part.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Plenty of Japanese people live happily on diets high in carbs - lots of rice, noodles, pasta.
With less of a car culture they also do alot of walking - I do at least 40minutes a day as part of my commute and lunch break, and dont think twice about a 20minute walk to get somewhere from the station (and then back again).
Hows the obesiety level in Japan even with the horrible, horrible high (complex) carb diets they have?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Its been found that what you eat isn't as important as how much exercise you get.
For someone who does no exercise, go outside and raising your heartbeat for 40minutes does a world of difference.
Trust me when I say simply 40minutes a day does make a difference.
I trust you. it Does make a difference to me.
No, am not talking bout muscles and supermodel's curve.
i'm a big eater, no exercise.
Do the walk around the neighbourhood every night for 45 mnt to an hour,depends.
After a month of summer holiday, friends told me that they think i've lost weight.
I didn't. but notice that half of the fat in my tummy's gone.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : i trust you.
It Does make a difference to me.
No, am not talking bout muscles and supermodel's curve.
i'm a big eater, no exercise.
Do the walk around the neighbourhood every night for 45 mnt to an hour,depends.
After a month of summer holiday, friends told me that they think i've lost weight.
I didn't. but notice that half of the fat in my tummy's gone.
You only take a walk during summer holiday?
Does the oppressive heat have any effect on your appetite?
When you say 'big eater' how many calories a day is that?
When you say 'big eater' what's the ratio of prot/carb/fat?
How many times do you eat every day?
What does it mean when you say 'no exercise' and then say 'walk around the neighborhood every night for 45 minutes?'
What's your height/weight/bust/booty size?
You said that [what you eat] makes a difference and then instead of supporting your claim with anecdotal evidence you start supporting his side of the argument by talking about losing fat [because] you're walking.
PM me a bikini photo.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Too many questions too lazy to type...*sigh*
Quote: : You only take a walk during summer holiday?
Does the oppressive heat have any effect on your appetite?
When you say 'big eater' how many calories a day is that?
When you say 'big eater' what's the ratio of prot/carb/fat?
How many times do you eat every day?
What does it mean when you say 'no exercise' and then say 'walk around the neighborhood every night for 45 minutes?'
What's your height/weight/bust/booty size?
The walking started 3 weeks before the holiday.
The thing is, during the summer holiday, 1 month break, not seeing any classmates, so when they saw me they told me they noticed the difference.
Still doing the walking now.
next.
All in one. i don't do diet.
Don't know stuff bout calories, carb, protein blahblah nutritions.
I choose what i eat based on what i like to eat.
And i like fried food, snacks, junk food, cakes and any buta.
Eat veggies sometimes just to avoid offending the cook.
I eat more than most of my friends, sometimes even more than the guys.
They're the one who call me 'big eater', so sue them.
I eat whenever i feel like to.
Not doing the counting also.
next.
The 'exercise' is referring to ewok's post.
I assume that 'exercise' term is for thing like going to gym, swimming blahblah doing sports seriously regularly.
If i'm wrong, that the exercise means walking too, sue ewok instead.
next.
Told you somewhere on the pot bout the height and weight.
Find it. go!
Quote: : You said that [what you eat] makes a difference and then instead of supporting your claim with anecdotal evidence you start supporting his side of the argument by talking about losing fat [because] you're walking.
No. i didn't said that Exactly words.
I said i'm a big eater.
I'm supporting the point that Walking make a difference.
It does For me though i didn't change my eating behaviour and the number of consumption.
Dunno for others.
Quote: : PM me a bikini photo.
Finally you get to your point.
Whew.
Dream on.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@Ewok
I'm talking about the average person.
Regardless if you want to bulk, cut or maitain your current weight, your goals for food TYPES should be the same.
High protien and fat, low carbs.
If you choose to have higher carbs, that should be a personal thing.
If your body can handle it without feeling sluggish after, then great.
Carbs are delicious and I wish I could have more in my diet.
If you are looking to bulk, you add more of everything, if you are looking to cut, cut 10 to 20 percent of your current calories to start losing healthy weight.
Weight loss (Or gain) is best, and more easily controlled through diet.
As for the McLes diet...he is simply postponeing the inevitable.
He will get sick.
Keep watching his page for future reports.
If he doesn't get sick, ask yourself, is it because he is exercising or because he had a liver translpant and is taking large amounts of supplements to make up for what he doesn't get out of the McDonalds food.
Or will this page suddenly disappear.
If you are looking to get healthy (Say you are feeling sick, under the weather, a bit depressed maybe, or have a lack of motivation and energy) would you say that changing from a fast food unhealthy diet to a healthier diet would fix these problems?
Or would you say that eating the same food, but adding some cardio and lifting to your daily routine would give you better results?
As for Japanese, genetics plays a role here.
Japanese eat rice, but in moderation compared to how we would eat fries back home.
Sure there are a few people out there that can eat more than the average person and not gain weight.
Those kinds of people are everywhere.
It doesn't mean they are healthy, it means that they are gifted with genetics that prevent them from putting on weight easily.
This is not such a great gift when you are a skinny Japanese boy that wants to put on muscle.
With age, many people lose this ability.
Honestly, people have to stop doing this ____ half-assed.
Eat right AND exercise.
Don't just do one and not the other in the hopes of achieving a greater healthier lifestyle.
Do both and reap the rewards of both.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Thanks for the clarification, Time.
I only wanted to say that your post was going in so many directions I couldn't make any sense of it.
If you walk for 45 minutes you go about 3-4 kilometers and burn roughly the same amount of calories as running 3-4 kilometers, so I considered it good aerobic cardiovascular exercise.
Some people claim they can eat a lot and stay skinny naturally and others complain that they eat like birds and and it turns straight to fat.
But, if you look at the way they eat, how many calories they consume and how many they burn then you'll see what's actually going on.
Calories in - calories out = + - body weight
It's simple and the rest is just about body maintenance.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I wouldn't say walking and running are the same.
It all depends on how high you get your heart rate.
Comparing a fat person walking 4 kilometers to someone in shape running 4 kilometers could be roughly the same.
Calories are such a personal thing.
The amount of calories eaten by person A can be different than person B even if their height, weight, age, sex and fitness level are the same.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Feck if you are serious about losing weigh and gaining muscle then do this.
www.bodyforlife.com
I sh!t you not if you do this at 100% you will see results and get compliments from everyone.
Do it or don't don't, I don't care.
But have a look at it and stop second guessing.
Diet won't work and exercise won't work by themselves, combine the two and you will win.
But don't go half way do the whole thing.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : I wouldn't say walking and running are the same.
It all depends on how high you get your heart rate.
Comparing a fat person walking 4 kilometers to someone in shape running 4 kilometers could be roughly the same.
Calories are such a personal thing.
The amount of calories eaten by person A can be different than person B even if their height, weight, age, sex and fitness level are the same.
Beavereater, although I wanted to go on and talk about target heart rate and genetics and body types, it just confuses most people.
If you're counting calories then you burn the same amount walking 1 kilometer as you do running 1 kilometer.
And yes, Burly, body4life is awesome.
I got turned on to mixing yoghurt with cottage cheese and have been happy ever since.
Damn I wish I could buy big tubs of cottage cheese here for cheap.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : ...
It's simple and the rest is just about body maintenance.
What kind of 'body maintenance' did you mean there ?
Another exercise ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : When you say 'big eater' how many calories a day is that?
When you say 'big eater' what's the ratio of prot/carb/fat?
How many times do you eat every day?
Normal people don't count calories, normal people don't map out the protein/carb/fat levels, and normal people don't spread meals out to 6 times a day.
These are all excellent ways to manage a diet, but how many people do it?
I'm sure it would be people who are familiar with the terms sets and reps, and would have a carefully managed exercise regime based on muscle groups as well.
Quote: : the 'exercise' is referring to ewok's post.
I assume that 'exercise' term is for thing like going to gym, swimming blahblah doing sports seriously regularly.
If i'm wrong, that the exercise means walking too, sue ewok instead.
By exercise I mean anything that gets you heart rate up, uses muscles and does so for a continued period of time.
Walking, cycling, swimming, jogging, tennis, sex, whatever you want.
Quote: : I'm talking about the average person.
Regardless if you want to bulk, cut or maitain your current weight STOP!
Right there, bulk/cut, they are not what average people care about.
The average person wants to eat what they want, and stay healthy.
They are not on an exercise plan and keep track of their weight, using their diet and cardio/weights to go through bulk and cut cycles.
Thats called body building or being an athelete.
Quote: : As for the McLes diet...he is simply postponeing the inevitable.
He will get sick.
Keep watching his page for future reports.
If he doesn't get sick, ask yourself, is it because he is exercising or because he had a liver translpant and is taking large amounts of supplements to make up for what he doesn't get out of the McDonalds food.
He's been going a year now.
Of course he is exercising and taking vitimins, I don't eat McDonalds every day but I still exercise, I still take vitimins.
Supersize Me was an interesting film, but had some serious issues.
He did no exercise, and probably walked even less than he did previously.
His meal choices weren't the best, he always went large and had normal coke, and often had desserts as well.
If you have a look at the McLes guy he will often have chicken and almost always has diet coke.
That alone is a huge start.
Quote: : As for Japanese, genetics plays a role here.
*rolls eyes*
Quote: : Japanese eat rice, but in moderation compared to how we would eat fries back home.
I have lived with about a dozen different Japanese families during my time in Japan.
Its not strange for people to have rice and something for breakfast, rice and something for lunch, and rice and something for dinner!
If it isn't rice its soba, udon, pasta.
I know the whole meso/endo/ecto theory, and agree it does seem to hold true, but are you suggesting that a majority of the country are ectomorphs?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Damn I wish I could buy big tubs of cottage cheese here for cheap.
And some decent low-GI bread
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Feck if you are serious about losing weigh and gaining muscle then do this.
www.bodyforlife.com Can you enter from Japan and how much does it cost .
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
In my opinion the average person will eventually move back to his/her normal everyday weight over the long term, unless they start counting calories and adding exercise to the mix or unless they continue to stay on their low calorie diet.
In the short term, people can lose weight, but in the long term those people will go back to the normal everyday weight that they were, unless they stay at a low calorie diet forever.
The reason is that they have no doubt lost muscle mass in the process of losing weight and cannot burn as many calories as before.
It is very difficult to lose fat while maintaining the muscle, which burns the calories.
By not knowing how many calories you are taking in everyday there is no way you can gradually burn off the fat while maintaining muscle.
To summarize, for the average person to diet by cutting calories, they will lose weight, but will need to stay at that same low caloric level forever in order not to rebound back up in size, if they return to their pre-diet maintenance level.
To be able to return to the pre-diet maintenance level after finishing the diet, you need to write everything down and start counting calories in order to spare as much muscle mass as possible while losing weight.
Also, need to be training with resistance weights as well.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Can you enter from Japan and how much does it cost .
Yes you can and it is free to enter.
You only have to use one of their products, but you can use the competitors products if you wish.
I have found that the EAS range tastes the best
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ewok, the idea behind eating 5-6 times a day is to maintain energy without loosing muscle.
I eat up to 7 times a day or once every 3 hours, when I train I never let myself become hungry because if I do then it is too late.
Eating becomes a job when you work out for gains.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Normal people don't count calories, normal people don't map out the protein/carb/fat levels, and normal people don't spread meals out to 6 times a day.
These are all excellent ways to manage a diet, but how many people do it?
I'm sure it would be people who are familiar with the terms sets and reps, and would have a carefully managed exercise regime based on muscle groups as well.
Normal people are fat and complain that they don't have a six pack while chugging a beer and eating pizza.
I'm talking about how people can EASILY make a change to their lifestyle in order to lose weight (mostly fat) and gain weight (Hopefully, mostly muscle).
If the average person knew how to do this, we'd all be OK.
People, like my mother and sisters, do know that the terms mean, but do not go to the gym.
They are not interested in devoting any time to the gym, but are willing to eat right.
They are in very good condition and are very healthy.
Quote: : STOP!
Right there, bulk/cut, they are not what average people care about.
The average person wants to eat what they want, and stay healthy.
They are not on an exercise plan and keep track of their weight, using their diet and cardio/weights to go through bulk and cut cycles.
Thats called body building or being an athelete.
While people might not understand the terms bulk cut, it is what many people would like to do.
Men want to add mass to their body for the purpose of looking good at the beach or in order to fill out a t-shirt.
A girl wants to cut in order to fit into her old clothes or look good in a bikini.
They simply refer to it as "getting big" or "dieting".
I track my calories, macronutrients and take supplements for where I fall short.
I Do cardio and lift weights and I bulk and cut, but I am certainly not a bodybuilder and have no wish to be one.
It's all about feeling and looking healthy (Actually, it's now about raw power)
Quote: : He's been going a year now.
Of course he is exercising and taking vitimins, I don't eat McDonalds every day but I still exercise, I still take vitimins.
Supersize Me was an interesting film, but had some serious issues.
He did no exercise, and probably walked even less than he did previously.
His meal choices weren't the best, he always went large and had normal coke, and often had desserts as well.
If you have a look at the McLes guy he will often have chicken and almost always has diet coke.
That alone is a huge start.
I understand that there were flaws with Supersize Me.
Most documentaries take a very subjective approach to their topics.
Some of it did hold true though.
The depression he felt had a lot to do with the lack of certain vitamines he was getting.
The fact that McLes is eating SOME food and avoid others is why he may be able to avoid getting fat.
Diet coke is certainly not bad at zero calories.
Quote: : *rolls eyes* Why roll your eyes?
It's most certainly true.
When you go back to Canada, the US or any other country it's so apparent that Westerners are FAT.
Japanese are NOT for the most part and it has EVERYTHING to do with their genetics.
Quote: : I have lived with about a dozen different Japanese families during my time in Japan.
Its not strange for people to have rice and something for breakfast, rice and something for lunch, and rice and something for dinner!
If it isn't rice its soba, udon, pasta.
I know the whole meso/endo/ecto theory, and agree it does seem to hold true, but are you suggesting that a majority of the country are ectomorphs?
Yes. You can go to any high school and look at the kids.
How many fat kids do you see compared to the amount you would see back home?
How many faily large (Muscular) kids would you see here compared to home (Like football player muscular).
You would see many here, I'm sure.
Yes the majority of the country is ectomorphs.
What would you say the majority are?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : Ewok, the idea behind eating 5-6 times a day is to maintain energy without loosing muscle.
I eat up to 7 times a day or once every 3 hours, when I train I never let myself become hungry because if I do then it is too late.
Eating becomes a job when you work out for gains.
The main idea behind having multiple meals is to maintain a high metabolism and your body will store what it does not immediatly need, so by having smaller but frequent meals your body uses the food more efficiently, stops itself from storing fat and will burn off stores of excess fat in the process.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : I track my calories, macronutrients and take supplements for where I fall short.
I Do cardio and lift weights and I bulk and cut, but I am certainly not a bodybuilder and have no wish to be one.
It's all about feeling and looking healthy (Actually, it's now about raw power) But by tracking calories, taking suppliments and having a well though out exercise routine you are an amature bodybuilder
Quote: : Why roll your eyes?
It's most certainly true.
When you go back to Canada, the US or any other country it's so apparent that Westerners are FAT.
Japanese are NOT for the most part and it has EVERYTHING to do with their genetics.
I think it has more to do with the culture and environment they are in than what their genetic makeup is.
Why did I roll my eyes?
We get the genetics line a the time.
Quote: : Yes.
You can go to any high school and look at the kids.
How many fat kids do you see compared to the amount you would see back home?
How many faily large (Muscular) kids would you see here compared to home (Like football player muscular).
You would see many here, I'm sure.
Yes the majority of the country is ectomorphs.
What would you say the majority are?
I've been a student in Japan, I know fine and well what the students are like, but also what they eat.
For a JHS/HS student the staple is either bread bought from the lunch ladies or your bento, which is mainly rice, pasta, veggies and maybe something meaty.
I've seen plenty of muscular kids here, go have a look in the change rooms some time.
Japanese diets are woefully lacking in protein, an essential ingredient for muscle gain.
Why do you think protein suppliments are recommended for muscle gain?
I would say the ecto/meso/endo ratios are not far from what they are in America or anywhere else, but the amount of exercise the kids get is completely different.
You dont get door-to-door car rides in Japan, Japan has more emphasis on sports with compulsary sport all the way through school and after school clubs.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : what kind of 'body maintenance' did you mean there ?
Another exercise ?
Eating vegetables and fruits keep your intestines clean.
Vitamins and minerals support rebuilding and disease fighting processes.
Exercise develops strong muscles, joints, and a healthy cardio-pulma-vascular system.
Drinking shitloads of water keeps everything running smoothly.
Etc
You can eat french fries all day and as long as you balance that with exercise you won't gain weight.
You'll destroy the inside of your body, but you won't gain weight.
That's the kind of maintenance I'm talking about.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : The main idea behind having multiple meals is to maintain a high metabolism and your body will store what it does not immediatly need, so by having smaller but frequent meals your body uses the food more efficiently, stops itself from storing fat and will burn off stores of excess fat in the process.
Actually, the idea of eating 6 to 8 meals a day isn't all that important.
While it is optimum to have more meals more frequently, it's a drop in the ocean compared to just eating healthy.
When you are looking to cut, the do it and see if you can get better results.
Macronutrient timing is far far more important.
Quote: : But by tracking calories, taking suppliments and having a well though out exercise routine you are an amature bodybuilder No.
A bodybuilder looks to gain mass and sculpt his/her body in the largest but most proportional size.
Taking supplements (Something everyone who doesn't get enough vits or fish oil in their daily diet should do) means nothing.
It doesn't help me grow, it just helps me stay healthy.
A well thought out routine is something EVERYONE who exercises should do.
If you don't you're waisting your time in the gym.
Tracking calories WAS a at first, but now it's pretty easy.
A little effort and ANYONE will be able to track them WITHOUT any help from software or even a pen and paper.
Quote: : I think it has more to do with the culture and environment they are in than what their genetic makeup is.
Why did I roll my eyes?
We get the genetics line a the time.
The genetics line is something fat people like to throw out as an excuse for why they are over-weight.
Saying that Japanese people have a genetic gift for keeping the pounds off is not such a leap.
Quote: : I've been a student in Japan, I know fine and well what the students are like, but also what they eat.
For a JHS/HS student the staple is either bread bought from the lunch ladies or your bento, which is mainly rice, pasta, veggies and maybe something meaty.
I've seen plenty of muscular kids here, go have a look in the change rooms some time.
Japanese diets are woefully lacking in protein, an essential ingredient for muscle gain.
Why do you think protein suppliments are recommended for muscle gain?
Are we talking about the same kids.
I'm not talking about kids with 6 packs due to a low body fat percentage.
When I say muscular I mean the ability to go out, play a contact sport, and NOT get run over.
As for protein supplements being recommened for muscle gain, that's not entirely true.
PROTEIN is recommened for muscle gain.
Supplements are just an easy way of getting them in.
No better no worse.
But why bring this up?
If they added more protein to their diet would they get bigger?
I think so. So it's diet that would affect them, right?
Quote: : I would say the ecto/meso/endo ratios are not far from what they are in America or anywhere else, but the amount of exercise the kids get is completely different.
You dont get door-to-door car rides in Japan, Japan has more emphasis on sports with compulsary sport all the way through school and after school clubs.
You really think so?
With Japan being mostly ectomorphs and thus skinny, how would you say that is the same as say America or anywhere else, where more than half the population is fat.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Quote: : You really think so?
With Japan being mostly ectomorphs and thus skinny, how would you say that is the same as say America or anywhere else, where more than half the population is fat.
Again, someone who is working in reverse - just because many people in Japan are skinny does not mean a large amount of people in Japan are ectos.
You cannot make that assumption without knowing what and how much every individual eats, and how much exercise they get.
Quote: : When you are looking to cut, the do it and see if you can get better results.
Macronutrient timing is far far more important.
Again, normal people aren't looking to cut.
They want to eat what they want, when they want (or can ), where they want (or can ).
The can is important, not everyone is lucky enough to be able to eat every 3 hours.
I work with computers and servers rooms are strictly no food/drink.
If I go to a client site I can't just excuse myself to go eat my meal.
Just doesn't work like that for normal people.
Quote: : A bodybuilder looks to gain mass and sculpt his/her body in the largest but most proportional size.
Taking supplements (Something everyone who doesn't get enough vits or fish oil in their daily diet should do) means nothing.
I'd repeat myself but that is what you are.
You are optimising your diet and exercise in order to maintain a certain bodytype - not all bodybuilders are about gaining massive muscle mass, and I did say amatuer.
Quote: : When I say muscular I mean the ability to go out, play a contact sport, and NOT get run over.
Yeah, I'm talking about the same.
Have you ever seen what the track boys look like under those loose clothes?
Ever arm wrestled a kendo kenshi?
Wrestled a judo practicioner, pissed off a Shorinji kenshi?
Only one school I went to had a rugby team and they were pretty solid.
I managed to get the baseball guys to have a game of rugby using my football and they were pounding the crap out of each other
Quote: : But why bring this up?
If they added more protein to their diet would they get bigger?
I think so. So it's diet that would affect them, right?
More protein, easier to gain muscle mass.
But then we are entering the amatuer BB grey zone again.
You are missing the entire "average person" area here, especially in regards to Japan.
Japanese people eat Japanese food.
They don't make changes to get more protein or to lower the carb levels, they don't even care if its complex or simple carbs.
They use whats in the fridge, whatever is on special, etc.
What I am saying is that even on what has been a normal diet for thousands of years that is high in carbohydrates, based around high carb staples such as bread, potatoe, rice, noodles, etc, a person can live healthly and hold a healthy weight without having to use suppliments, without having to count calories, change the protein/carb/fat ratios, by simply exercising daily even if its nothing more than a 40 minute walk each day.
Why do I know this?
When did obesiety become the problem it did today?
If you don't look at diet, what is the main factors that have changed?
And where is obesiety a problem and what factors are different in these places compared to other places where obesiety is not a problem?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
[Quote: =Ewok]Again, someone who is working in reverse - just because many people in Japan are skinny does not mean a large amount of people in Japan are ectos.
You cannot make that assumption without knowing what and how much every individual eats, and how much exercise they get.
people who eat mostly carbs, high calorie dishes with little protein who, for the most part, do not have a problem with obesity...I would put money on classing most as ectos.
Body type and exercise having nothing to do with each other.
An ecto MUST eat more and do cardio LESS in order to gain mass.
[Quote: =Ewok]Again, normal people aren't looking to cut.
They want to eat what they want, when they want (or can ), where they want (or can ).
Why would you say normal people aren't looking to cut?
How many girls have you met that HAVEN'T said "I need to lose weight.
I'm going on a diet." What about guys that say "I need to get ripped before the summer." Plenty of people.
Them might not use the term 'cut' but I'm sure that's what they mean.
I'm not denying that they don't want to eat what they want...everyone wants to eat what they want.
If you are looking to be healthy, you can't do that without damaging your insides.
[Quote: =Ewok]The can is important, not everyone is lucky enough to be able to eat every 3 hours.
I work with computers and servers rooms are strictly no food/drink.
If I go to a client site I can't just excuse myself to go eat my meal.
Just doesn't work like that for normal people.
I think we need to clarify the definition of a meal.
A protein shake can be a meal.
A CalorieMate can be a meal (Although not a great one).
A meal isn't going to the kitchen a preparing something on the stove, it doesn't even have to be as simple as a sandwich.
It can be a drink or shake of some kind.
This is as easy as going to the toilet.
I'll admit, this isn't for everyone though.
It takes some devotion.
However, as I said, it is certainly not necessary.
I don't, I eat 3 maybe 4 meals a day.
The 4th being a snack before bed.
[Quote: =Ewok]I'd repeat myself but that is what you are.
You are optimising your diet and exercise in order to maintain a certain bodytype - not all bodybuilders are about gaining massive muscle mass, and I did say amatuer.
I think we'll have to agree to disagree here.
A bodybuilder, amateur or not, looks to gain pure mass and is not looking to live a healthy lifestyle.
They more often than not, sacrifice health for size abusing (Using and abusing are different) steroids.
They forgoe cardio to limit the amount of muscle lost.
A different world IMO.
[Quote: =Ewok]Yeah, I'm talking about the same.
Have you ever seen what the track boys look like under those loose clothes?
Ever arm wrestled a kendo kenshi?
Wrestled a judo practicioner, pissed off a Shorinji kenshi?
Only one school I went to had a rugby team and they were pretty solid.
I managed to get the baseball guys to have a game of rugby using my football and they were pounding the crap out of each other
I actually teach a few track boys and girls and they are by no means strong.
I tried teaching the boys how to squat, and I doubt they could squat anywhere near their own body weight.
Judo students that I HAVE had the opportunity to mess around with DO control their diets to an extent.
If you looked at some of the best in the world, you would find that without diet they would not be as strong as they are.
Sumo wrestlers certainly don't achieve their size by eating and laying around the house.
It's diet.
More protein, easier to gain muscle mass.
But then we are entering the amatuer BB grey zone again.
No grey zone here.
More protein does not equal easier muscle mass.
It's a combination of protein carbs and fat AND proper lifting that equals MORE muscle mass than with just one or the other.
[Quote: =Ewok]You are missing the entire "average person" area here, especially in regards to Japan.
Japanese people eat Japanese food.
They don't make changes to get more protein or to lower the carb levels, they don't even care if its complex or simple carbs.
They use whats in the fridge, whatever is on special, etc.
I wouldn't generalize Japanese people as this either.
In recent years (And by all means, ask the ladies) they have been restricting their carbs.
I can't remember the term, but sushi restaurants offer smaller portions of rice in their nigiri-sushi so that the girls can eat more without worry about eating more carbs.
A lot of girls (Including my wife) restrict their carbs to morning and afternoon (Rice in particular).
I think it's hard to define the 'average' person.
Too many kinds of people out their.
Quote: : What I am saying is that even on what has been a normal diet for thousands of years that is high in carbohydrates, based around high carb staples such as bread, potatoe, rice, noodles, etc, a person can live healthly and hold a healthy weight without having to use suppliments, without having to count calories, change the protein/carb/fat ratios, by simply exercising daily even if its nothing more than a 40 minute walk each day.
Food in general was more rationed back in the day.
People were far FAR more active than most today, which plays a role in how they looked.
What about life expectancy 1000 years ago?
I think with proper diet you would see people living longer.
Why do I know this?
When did obesiety become the problem it did today?
If you don't look at diet, what is the main factors that have changed?
And where is obesiety a problem and what factors are different in these places compared to other places where obesiety is not a problem?
Why would I NOT look at diet.
I think we've gottena bit off track.
If you want to be HEALTHY you need to eat HEALTHY.
You can't eat like crap, exercise and expect to have the same health as someone who eats chicken salads.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Did anyone else notice that the OP was SPAMing the threads?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Yup...but we sparked a debat.
Made lemonade...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Yeah, I was scratching my head about that too.
GP is the only forum I have seen yet where a spam actually causes a serious debate.
Waiting for the organ enhancers and Rolex watches now...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
A person can have a pre-disposition towards ecto- endo- meso-morph body type but this can be changed through the diet and exercise routine that you pursue.
Discuss.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|