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I am ashamed to be a Philadelphia Eagle fan... - Democratic Underground

All those years of lousy teams, worse coaches, bad luck, stupid draft and signing moves, I stuck with my team. But this Michael Vick business is off the charts...what they're doing is trying to knock the Phillies off the front page.

My kid went to school with Andy Reid's drug-riddled/convicted kids and this BS about how this is reminiscent of his family is utter crap.

He doesn't, and never did, give a shit about those kids. Until Vick and Reid are gone along with that ultra-putz Joe Banner, and owner Jeff Lurie apologizes (That'll soon happen ) I'm off the bandwagon.

I'd do. You're a very brave man/woman for taking such a principled stand.

"Taking a principled stand" by ranting on an anonymous board on the internet doesn't require any bravery at all.

If you ever find it, mine it and sell it.

... "I don't agree with you, so I'll attempt to ridicule you by pretending to see irony when there is none." Nice try.

Trades on "deep, rich vein of irony".

They do it in nearly every post I have seen by them.

On professional sports teams.

Wonder how you feel about the owner of two pit bulls that recently mauled the owner's 20-year old brother to death?

There seems to be more compassion for people killers than Vic.

And the beat goes on...dog fighting continues in the south and cock-fighting too.

Carried out by some of the same folks who are hollering the loudest about Vic.

For God's sake, he has paid his dues and continues to pay.

But then, we all know what is behind the extreme level of hate directed at Vic, don't we?

This oughta be good.

PETA's Statement on Eagles Vick Signing PETA and millions of decent football fans around the world are disappointed that the Philadelphia Eagles have chosen to sign a man who hanged dogs from trees, electrocuted them with jumper cables, held them underwater until they drowned in his swimming pool, and even threw his own family dogs into the fighting pit to be torn to shreds while he laughed.

What sort of message does this send to young fans who care about animals and don't want to see them be harmed? PETA certainly hopes that Vick has learned his lesson and feels truly remorseful for his crimes—but since he's given no public indication that that's the case, only time will tell.

At this point, all Eagles fans can do is cross their fingers and hope that they won't ever have to explain to their sons and daughters what a "rape rack" is and why their favorite player was using one, as Falcons fans once had to.

I know for me the hate comes from knowing this person tortured and killed animals for his own greed and amusement.

He had it all, but that wasn't enough.

Dog-fighting, cock-fighting are barbaric and cruel.

Dante Stallworth did not wake up that morning with the intent to kill or harm someone.

He was stupid, irresponsible and wrong, but he was not evil. Vick woke up for years with the intent to train dogs or have them trained to maim and kill one another and, when they were of no use anymore, he left them to die in pools of their own blood at the bottom of trash barrels. Hardly an apt comparison. Vick can work, but he needs to be stocking cheap Chinese crap at the Wal-Mart instead of earning millions while being, sadly, influential to children and young adults.

Because for me it's that he killed innocent animals for his amusement and got a slap on the wrist that is condoned by some as "punishment". So if you came up with that answer, congratulations.

You hit it right on the head.

As always. Now, they're a bigger halfway house for losers. Go Phils.

Go Stillers. Go Pens.

(Sorry, I don't have much reason to laugh at Phillies fans lately). All I can say about Vick is... I'm glad that the Jets didn't sign him.

Buh-Bye!

But it's true...they did lose although it was close toward the end... Happy Pats fan...

I guess you fit the latter.

Is NON- football fans in a uproar threatening boycotts.

(not the OP. Don't know if he's a FB fan)

... the stands would be empty in just about every venue. Outrage can be fun.

Some people will, some people won't.

In the end I think Vick's will fade away into the night after a failed attempt to regain his career.

And, any rational means you take is just fine. Personally, I think that Vick has paid his due, and it's time to move on.

Especially with my morning coffee.

With my evening beer taint bad either.

Not advertisers.

I kept hearing these reports about "what a great fit Vick would be in Pittsburgh." I was ready to fold my Terrible Towel up and put it away for the season.

Sorry buddy.

And then on top of that they go out and sign Michael Vick.

They've got more parole officers than scouts.

I lol'd.... I have a standing bet with my boss every year for $100 based on which team (Eagles or 'Skins - my team) has the better record at the end of the year. He has won every year...so far.

I think that this is my year.

Arrest, conviction, or won/loss?

Won-loss...

Or in court?

Tell me this is all in jest...

You're kidding me, right? The guy committed a crime, did his time, and is trying to move on.

Them on?

I was more referring to the PETA onslaught and indignation.

As far as your concern..I just ignore and do not cheer the ones in mt teams that I do not like.

Hung his dogs and when they survived he drowned them.

But I guess he did his time, lets reward him with millions of dollars.

If you or I were convicted of a felony and served time we would not be rewarded with our old jobs back and get paid millions of dollars for doing so.

But as you and I both know the rich and famous do not get treated like us.

Why should Vick be singled out? BTW, I am a life-long dog lover and cat owner.

"BTW, I am a life-long dog lover and cat owner."

He's a sadistic bastard even by my standards which are usually rather low.

This creep threw his own pets into the ring so he could watch them get torn to shreds.

"Did his time" my ass...

I'm certainly not defending his actions, but I like to believe people can learn, and change.

Because dogs are considered property he got a slap on the wrist for what he did. "In late November 2008, Vick was transported to Virginia to face the state charges.

On November 25, he appeared before the Surry County Circuit Court at a session held in neighboring Sussex County (because the Surry court building was undergoing renovation).

He submitted a guilty plea to a single Virginia felony charge for dog fighting, receiving a 3 year prison sentence, imposition of which was suspended upon condition of good behavior, and $2500 fine.

In return for the plea agreement, the other charge was dropped.

" A single charge and he the punishment was dropped. Yeah, sorry, you can think he did his time but he got nothing more than a slap on the wrist.

It has always been that way, and not just for the Michael Vicks of the world.

Justice has always been meted out on a sliding scale based on, who you know or your parents know, and how much money you have to pay for a good defense attorney. Seems this guy got some favors too....granted the crime was nothing compared to Vicks...but I doubt you or I would be treated the same. Governor Bush was arrested in 1972 for cocaine possession, and taken to Harris County Jail, but avoided jail or formal charges through an informal diversion plan involving community service with Project P.U.L.L., an inner city Houston program for troubled youths at the Martin Luther King Jr.

Community Center in Houston's dirt-poor Third Ward.

Ray Lewis of the Baltimore Ravens (still playing) was accessory to murder - never even went to trial. Sorry, but Mike Vick is WAAAAYYYY behind that on the outrage train. At least Vick was tried and convicted, and served the time required by law.

Or do you believe that people CANNOT be rehabilitated, as the Freepers do?

Because I think the man has to earn forgiveness I'm compared to a "Freeper" now. And you have your outrages, I have mine.

I can't be outraged by more than one thing like some people?

OK, that's fine.

Didn't call you a freeper.

Your tone indicated Vick was beyond forgiveness despite his having served his debt to society as required by law.

The foreclosing of forgiveness is a freeperish trait, and I was asking if you shared that belief.

It appears you do not - you just have a high bar for forgiveness in this particular case - so I stand corrected.

Barking at his appearance on the field would send a clear signal to the team owners. I know he did is time and wants to move on, however, his crimes rise to the level of a sexual deviation and he should have all the restraints placed upon him that any pervert would get. His vile crimes are compounded by his lack of remorse.

Buy a brand that sends a goodly amount of its profits to humane shelters or some other charity and then pelt the shit out of that sadistic asshole when he walks on the field.

He'll be in pads, so he won't feel one tenth of the physical pain he put those dogs through, but he'll get the message. Here's some treats that go to charity: http://www.dancingdogblog.com/2009/06/1423 / Here's another: http://www.barkingbiscuit.com/PawsForCharity.html

But that's just me.

I can't believe I have to be the guy to point this out, but Michael Vick was caught on a fallacious search warrant, was convicted anyway, and served his time in prison. I hate to pull a page out of the knuckle-dragger's handbook, but I distinctly recall most of us dismissing the association of our President with a domestic terrorist who once bombed the Capitol and the Pentagon, and then became a fugitive from the law.

Now he teaches. You simply can't have it both ways.

Thats where your analogy falls apart, the man did the crime not spend time with someone who did.

...I cannot believe that I have to be the guy to point this out, but Michael Vick engaged in the practice of torturing and killing dogs as well as forcing them to fight each other to the death for entertainment. Just because he served his time, does not mean that we have to forgive him.

Just a reminder...

Vick took part in hanging dogs from trees, electrocuting dogs with jumper cables, drowning, and shooting dogs...in addition to the cruel dogfights. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bad_Newz_Kennels_dog_fight... Pondscum Vick should still be behind bars. The analogy of Barak Obama at a meet & greet party with Ayers versus torturing dogs is terrible.

You can't begin to equate the two.

I'm sorry I brought it up.

You go back to being upset over your dog torturer and I'll go back to wondering why all the human torturers are busy plotting their return to the White House...

And watching football.

IN forty years I'll accept that enough time has passed and that Vick probably has changed.

Then I'll have no problem with him playing in the NFL. Ayers had to rebuild his life one block at a time.

So should Vick.

Vick did a bad thing.

He will always be bad because of it, and can never redeem himself.

Ever.

Michael Vick's second chance is being released back into society.

Should be allowed to go back to making a living be based on how much money you make at it? Wheres the cutoff point for "makes too much money to be allowed to make your living like that again"?

Hanging our dogs and when they didn't die we individually held our dogs heads underwater until they were dead, we wouldn't be allowed to work at our old job.

Since Vick is a pro football player he is allowed to do so.

There are different standards for them than us.

In Mr. Vicks case that employer happens to be the Eagles.

I'm betting the Eagles will regret signing him.

"Hide Your Dog". I think the backlash has already begun.

Working as a factory worker for a company I can guarantee that if we were convicted of a crime and served time, we wouldn't be asked to return to that company. edited for spelling, okay.

The recidivism rate is high because of this shitty social attitude. Instead of complaining that a company is taking a risk, they should be aplauded and USED AS AN EXAMPLE for other companies to follow, big and small. Of course this never enters the pitchfork mentality that I see here.

And let him get a job at Wal-Mart, the reality is that you or I would not be able to get a job doing that because we were convicted felons, and the nature of the crime would prevent it.

I am all for Vick being an example just not in the NFL getting paid 4 million dollars. The message it sends is that people in positions of power are held to different standards than the rest of us.

Should be used as an example for Wallmart to also hire cons are you missing? WHOOS By a mile...

Or more. This eye for an eye mentality is exactly why we will continue to have this recidivism rate. So in your view, he shold still be in jail, perhaps the death penalty should be appropriate, or life...

Since we all know there can never be any learning in jail or redemption. Okie dokie...

Why this country will continue to incarcerate as high a percentage of the population as it does. Indeed a very progressive attitude... He did his time, he found an employer, you have convinced me, I will pen a letter to the Eagles applauding them for their very PROGRESSIVE attitude regarding this conman. Thanks. I will even root for him during the season...

Mind you, I DO NOT watch sports. But it is the progressive thing to do. Oh and I am willing to bet that if he had less melanin in his skin attitudes would be a little different too. And I am also willing to bet a lot of that is not even conscious.

Celebrities go to jail for drugs, assault, DUI, spousal abuses, etc and once they get out, they can go back to making movies/music/tv shows.

If I did any of the above, I would not be able to return to my federal job.

Face it, there is a different standard for celebrities vs us regular folk. I am a NY Giant fan, but I will be watching and rooting for Mr.

Vick.

I don't get it. Why?

Vick has been getting lynched by so many self-righteous people for no apparent reasons.

Trust me, there are a lot worse people out there who have not gotten the amount of scorn that Vick has gotten.

I just don't get the hate.

I don't want to make this a racial thing, but it seems as if it is only white people who have this problem with Mr.

Vick. I have yet to meet a Black, Hispanic, or Asian person who is as angry about this issue as some of the whites that I hear yelling on TV. In terms of being a Giant fan and rooting for Vick, well, have you ever heard of Fantasy Football?

The average FF fan has a main team that they like, but they also root for individual players.

Sure wish I saw those emotions in regards to the daily abuses of children throughout the world. By the way, that's an awesome pair of Nikes you're wearng.

You say you purchased them at Walmart for how much?....what a great price hmmmm SPORTSWEAR giant Nike has pulled out of a factory in Cambodia after being caught up in a child labour scandal. Children as young as 12 are said to have been working seven days a week for just pounds 31 a month at the factory which manufactures clothes for Nike

Michael vick gets to go back to his old job and make millions of dollars.

Michael Vick already got his second chance when he was released from prison, anything he gets beyond that is his responsibility to get.

Just like we aren't expected to give any convict that walks out of prison a job. If I commit a felony, I wouldn't get hired back to my old job within a year of being released, it is only rich and famous people like Michael Vick who get that sort of treatment.

Another corporation recognized his specialized skill set, and feel that he will help their organization. so what?

Mr. Vick has no other marketable skills. I guess all the dog-catcher jobs were filled.

And he's finished his sentence under the law. what's the problem...?

I just don't have to watch him earn millions doing it.

That very last step out of the prison doors on an inmate's last day and back into the world is merely the first step on a long road to freedom.

That's his second fucking chance- everything else will have to be earned. And he's earned nothing...

Yet.

From a Lions fan.

Thank you, Highland Park, Texas.

Try this place. My 2nd home. http://www.mlive.com/lions/

Tom K's great. Here's where I go to yak-yak the Leos blah-blah: http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=93&f=1801

That the Eagles are the bane of the league.

They are already huge disappointments anyway so I guess it will take a dog killer to push them over the brink.

He had his shot. He blew it.

He used his good fortune to torture innocent animals for his own amusement.

Let him take his free ride college education and go work for a living like the rest of us.

I predict the Eagles regret their decision soon.

They share his level of barbarity.

I used to work for PETA so that gives you an idea where I stand on animal issues so if you want to call me an enabler go for it, but it ain't true. That said, PETA has had people in the past that at one time or another worked at slaughter houses and then ended up working with the organization.

Doing undercover work, speaking out about the inhumane methods used in slaughter, etc.

To paint Vick with the "he hasn't changed" brush is a bit early.

I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt until he proves otherwise.

What he did was despicable and he served more time than most would because of his celebrity.

Hell, most people who hurt animals don't get much more than a fine.

If they do get jail time, it's not often much more than 90 days (if that). I'm a liberal and my liberal ways tell me that once someone has served their time, it's time for their second chance.

It's time for Vick's chance and it's up to him to do the best with it.

Lets see if he does.

But if the slipper fits.... Vick served his time and is a free man. That said, he's a sick, barbaric, un-evolved primate that tortured animals for fun.

Any ill-advised support for his "rehabilitation" is ingenuous and naive.

His behavior was pathological and I do not believe for a moment that he wouldn't resume his fetish if he didn't fear imprisonment. I don't believe in lip-sync liberalism.

Dangerous people need to be treated if possible and sequestered if not.

Vick is a dangerous person that needs much further treatment, not the adoration of fans. The franchise has a responsibility to promote good sportsmanship as well as provide entertainment.

There's nothing sporting about dog-fights.

His behavior should exclude him as surely as Pete Rose.

I'm afraid the term 'good sportsmanship' is a phrase of the past.

It's all about winning no matter how you do it.

If you have to hire a pathological brute to win, then so be it. Ethics, schmethics.

Nice. I'm starting to get a vibe about some of these posters.

How do you feel about the strong (and well-documented) link between torture of animals and abuse of humans? I'm sure there's no reason at all that PETA asked Mr.

Vick's representatives for psychological testing when it was floated he become their spokesperson. In the meantime, your argument about "he served more time" isn't the case in Washington State.

You might want to Google "Pasado's Law". There is no way you or anyone else can put lipstick on this pig.

The coach's interview last night was unbelievable.

When I was little, I was abused.

In turn I took out my frustration on our household animals.

I understand there is a difference between what I did and what Vick did.

However, I no longer hurt animals, I despise people who do (as I stated I worked for PETA for several years fighting the good fight) and I think that others are capable of the same capability to change.

Does that mean because I hurt animals when I was younger that I fit under the brush you're using?

No, I don't. There is a culture to those who fight dogs, roosters, or any other kind of animal.

It doesn't make it right, it doesn't make it pleasant but it doesn't mean that people aren't capable of changing once they are educated.

Is Vick one of these people?

Who knows but until he shows that he hasn't learned his lesson, I'll stand on the side that he has.

Does it matter that he changes because he fears going back to jail?

No, all that matters is that he doesn't do it again. As far as the laws in Washington state, that isn't the case in most states.

There are very few states that treat animal cruelty seriously.

I still stand by my statement that he got the amount of time he did because of his celebrity.

I know this may sound contradictory but I'd have been happy if he'd done more time but I'm grateful he got the amount of time he did get.

If they can get elected to mayor or city council or higher positions (and some have) after serving their time, they can sure get a job as an athlete.

I don't think we need a law that released felons cannot make more than a certain amount or have jobs that have a high public profile. If too many idolize professional athletes that is a cultural problem that we need to deal with, but don't punish the individual felons who did their time and want to find the best, legal job that they can.

I'm almost 50 now.

I won't watch any NFL game until Vick is gone.

The NFL made it possible for the Eagles to sign Vick. The whole league should suffer a boycott.

It's time to forgive the man and let him earn a chance at a living.

I can understand how passionate anminal lovers are.

But to hound a man for the rest of his life after he's served his time and paid his debt to society is groosly unfair.

Forgive and forget people.

Forgive and forget. Sure.

Kill innocent animals for your amusement, get a slap on the wrist for what you did, and somehow everything is supposed to be A-OK. I have no problems with felons getting jobs.

I encourage it in fact.

But to turn around and give the man millions of dollars?

No. Sorry. If any of us had done what Mr.

Vick did we'd likely be rotting in jail and be unable to get any decent job.

I know people who have done time.

You can't sit there and hold a man's past over their head the rest of their life.

Vic served his time.

He paid his debt to society.

The eagles have seen fit to give him a second chance and I'm almost hoping they kick ass this season because of it.

And if that causes you to hate me well then all I have to say is meh.

Go ahead and hate me. You say its okay for felons to have a job.

So why is it not okay for Vick to have a job and do something that he loved.

The man made a mistake.

The man paid a price for it.

Let him live in peace.

It is cruel and sadistic. And for what it's worth, I don't hate anyone.

You are more than entitled to your opinion.

I just happen to disagree with it. I said in another post long ago....the sad thing is that the dogs probably would have forgiven him.

I guess they're just better than I am.

We would have a hard time getting a job at Wal-Mart when they found out the nature of our felony.

Vick served his time and two weeks later was reinstated by the NFL and there are far too many people defending him on DU, sad really.

Gross.

Because his opinion is different then yours?

I wholeheartedly agree with you.

When it looked like the Patriots might consider hiring him as backup to Brady. Robert Kraft rejected the idea, however. I have mixed feelings about this. As an animal lover (to put it mildly), I was, and still am, disgusted by what Vick got himself involved in. But football is Business.

And unless a player's performance (i.e.

Money-earning ability) is affected, the bottom line is always going to be money.

With the exception of severe behavior problems. So if the Patriots had hired Vick, I really don't know how I would have felt about it.

Granted, I would have been highly disappointed, but beyond that, I really don't know. I think Robert Kraft may have had some good input from Bill Belichick, who seems to be a master at seeing potential in players.

No doubt BB saw some kind of impediment, and maybe that's why Vick wasn't hired, or even interviewed. Whatever happens in Philly, I hope that Donovan McNabb's position isn't usurped by Vick.

Lots of people don't like McNabb, but I think he's a quality QB, and who knows what ability/confidence Vick may have lost during his time out of football.

Signing Michael Vick would end it for me.

Or a new sport

That's a good thing.

This whole Vick thing will be a single season issue.

Right now, Vick is McNabb's backup.

There is a possibility that Vick may never even step onto the field during a game (slight, but possible).

That gives him time to get back in shape and for the Eagles to evaluate his professional abilities.

A good PR strategy for the team would be to get Vick out there doing PSAs for USHS and ASPCA with a mea culpa bent. I say this as someone to whom football season means one thing - traffic is heavy right before a Packers game, and streets are clear during a Packers game.

I also happen to be an avid animal rights person. As such, I am grateful to M.

Vick and his money for one thing - he proved that the canine victims of dog fighting CAN be rehabilitated.

Before the wealthy Mr.

Vick's fall from grace, these dogs were put down because they could NOT be rehabilitated.

Well, that particular piece of 'general knowledge' was proven wrong. My view is that if these 'dogs that can not be rehabilitated' actually could be, who's to say Mr.

Vick couldn't be as well.

And, in the event that he can't be, well, I want him to have enough money to be able to rehabilitate his surviving canine victims, so let him play. And, if enough NFL fans are so put off by his actions that they absolutely refuse to go see a game while Mr.

Vick is on the roster, the Eagles will use that as part of their 'professional evaluation'.

And, Mr. Vick will learn that actions do have consequences, sometimes beyond the 'legal implications'. That's my $ .02

I have no idea how changed a person he is in this amount of time.

I'm an animal lover, and this is just hard to let pass.

While I will still likely remain a fan, the front office really disgusts me sometimes.

I think I'm a compassionate person, and I do think Vick deserves to make a living - but I wouldn't want him on my football team.

He would show real contrition by making a living helping animals instead of going for football again so soon.

I wish it wasn't in the NFL, but that's what he does.

I think the Eagles deserve a shitload of scorn for hiring him, and I hope they get it. To me, I need to see actions from Vick, not just words.

I'm sicking of people finding God only after everyone else has realized they're a fuckup.

Been listening to sports radio WIP and it's there.

Maybe they'll lose some actual fans over it. Besides, the Philadelphia Flyers are more fun anyways.

Eagles haven't. Have a good day, Forkboy!

So it's safe to guess who I'll be rooting for. Have a good one!

...at least Vick has finally made you come around. I've been an NFL fan since I was 4 years old (not an Eagles fan), but at the age of 46, I'm almost done. At this point I feel like I'm just cheering for the uniform and the memories it invokes.

I still love the game, just not the business it has become and the personalities that dominate it now.

Your home team could be The Lions.

We here in the Detroit area have had to endure a lifetime of crap on the gridiron.

Bless their hearts for taking the chance on Vick.

Michael Vick did the crime and has served his time.

I believe everyone deserves a second chance.

I'm not anti-dog as I have my own mini schnauzer and she's the cutest thing in the world!! The Eagles are now my second favorite team because they did what many people are not willing to do, give the man a second chance.

Thank you Andy Reid and thank you Jeff Lurie. The Michael Vick saga is finally over guys Time to drop the issue.

When I was a kid, maybe 13 or 14, I used to go fishing with an old black man, in his 70s at the time I believe, who seemed to offer up a pearl of wisdom every weekend. To shorten up the story, one day out of no where he said to me "Boy, you can tell a lot about a Man by the way he treats his Dawg". I believe that too. Biker

Some team was going to pick him up regardless.

Believe it or not people are playing in the nfl, probably even on the Eagles, who have done worse.

How dare you boo SANTA

It sounded... but your point is taken...

McNabb was the 8th rated QB last year by football outsiders.

They got an ok back up behind him.

I really don't see the upside to the team bringing in this distraction when the QB position seems like a position not in need.

Which, given his track record, won't be long. In the finest Philly sports tradition, he would then be booed off the field in his own stadium!

Our team.

I've been rooting for this team since they played their games in Franklin Field, Mr.

Charming...this whole debacle is going to blow up in the faces of Lurie and Banner and we had a Super Bowl caliber team before this.

Who needed this distraction...but then again, with 700-Level-intelligentsia guys like you around, maybe it's what this team deserves at this point.

Has been VERY clear that he/she/shit is really upset about folks that truly care about animals.

Belittling folks that prioritize their pets is a damn crucifixion to that douchebag.




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